267 Home Builder Customer Engagement AI Tools - Mike Bills May 7 2025

Greg Bray: [00:00:00] Hello, everybody, and welcome to today's episode of The Home Builder Digital Marketing Podcast. I'm Greg Bray with Blue Tangerine. 

Kevin Weitzel: And I'm Kevin Weitzel with OutHouse. 

Greg Bray: And we're excited to have joining us today, Mike Bills. Mike is the president at AtlasRTX. Welcome, Mike. Thanks for joining us today. 

Mike Bills: My pleasure. It's always fun to talk to you guys. 

Greg Bray: Well, Mike, for those who haven't had a chance to meet you yet, why don't you give us that quick background about yourself? 
Mike Bills: Sure. So, again, I'm president of AtlasRTX. I joined Atlas in October of 2020. So, right in the depths of COVID, [00:01:00] that's when I was introduced to the industry of home building. And I know that we'll talk about that a little more, but what an interesting time for that introduction in October of 2020. And I joined Atlas because my dear friend Bassam Salem, who founded Atlas, we had met back in 2013 when I had founded sort of an early AI company, and I had sold a majority interest of that to private equity. 

Part of our investment thesis was spinning that business out. And anyway, we did a nationwide search for a CEO and ended up finding Bassam, who coincidentally lived next door to one of my wife's college gymnastics teammates. I mean, it's just crazy. We looked everywhere and found this guy in our backyard, and he was too smart to come work for me. But when I ultimately, you know, sold out and was a free agent, then Bassam reached out to me, and fortunately, I was smart enough to come work for him.

I'm homegrown in Salt Lake City. So, Atlas we are in Park City, Utah, so that's where I am right now. I'm right across from the Utah Olympic Park, where the ski jumping and luge, and bobsled took place in the [00:02:00] 2002 Olympics, and we'll be doing it again in 2034. And I'll never leave Salt Lake. My life doesn't work anywhere else. I like to work hard and I like to play hard. So, I go skiing every day after work for half the year and the other half I go mountain biking each day after work. So, it's an enviable lifestyle and I'm really grateful for it and grateful for the opportunity to be here at Atlas. 

Kevin Weitzel: All right, so besides taking lunch breaks down the uh, ski jump, tell us something about you personally that has nothing to do with the work industry, your family? 

Mike Bills: Sure. So, an area that is a tremendous passion of mine is higher education. So, I'm the first in my family to graduate from college. College was not something that my parents even really understood, but it fortunately turned out to be something that was important to me, But it was really hard to go to school as a first-generation student. When I fell into it, I loved it, so I kept going to school. I've collected a bunch of degrees, but I've also worked hard in the institutions where I've worked. 

So, I've served as a board member at [00:03:00] Westminster College. And I currently serve on the board of Antioch University. My passion there is helping students from underserved backgrounds get into and graduate from college. So, that is where I spend all of my volunteer time is trying to help students that might not get an education. You know, the education market, they pride themselves on selectivity, like literally, they're proud of all the people they don't let in, and I am working to change that and make education more inclusive. 

Kevin Weitzel: So with all that education, do you make everybody in the office call you Dr. Mike and or when you leave a board meeting, do they, uh, throw up finger quotes and go, Ooh, Dr. Mike spoke, does that ever happen? 

Mike Bills: That does happen. The Ooh, Dr. Mike spoke, but no, nobody calls me doctor. There is a technical term in academia and industry for people that require you to call them doctor so and so and [00:04:00] that is a-hole. Anybody that requires you to do that that isn't like doing brain surgery then, yeah, they're in a-hole. 

Greg Bray: Now, let's address the big elephant in the room then. Do we still need education with all this AI stuff that you guys are building or is the fact that it's just going to do all the work for us?

Mike Bills: Yeah, boy, that would be a sad state of affairs if we just feed it everything that we need to know, to AI. That'd be the same thing as roll the clock back 30 years ago and say, Hey, my best friend's really smart, he can just do everything and tell me about it and I'll just ride his coattails. So, no, the answer to that is a definitive no. In fact, I would contend that the more AI does, the more you need to know. It's a whole lot better to be in power and guiding AI to do what you want rather than have it roll over you and become its servant. 

Kevin Weitzel: So, let me ask you this then, because this brings us to kind of like a weird philosophical area. I've said this before, and I'll say it again. The [00:05:00] smartphone. The smartphone has given us so many things that we utilize every day, but it has also made people painfully stupid. They don't know how to do anything. They just know how to operate an app. They know how to push a button and let the app tell them what the next thing they're gonna do is. Do you not feel that AI is providing the same type of stupidity that we can lean against it and basically just ignorantly accept whatever it says versus just simply leveraging it to your advantage? 

Mike Bills: That's an interesting comparison and I could speak for hours utilizing just that comparison of the phone and its impact on humanity versus AI and its impact on humanity. So, the phone was truly transformational, right? It transformed worldwide society. It was amazing how fast it went from being a luxury good to simply something that everybody, almost regardless of socioeconomic status across the world, had and it had a fundamental societal change, for good and bad. Historians will look [00:06:00] back and they'll speak to the significance of these things. AI is nowhere near that type of transformation, not even close. 

I'm an interesting speaker on AI because I run an AI company and yet I'm deeply suspicious about it. I know the BS claims about it and I'm happy to talk about those. AI can certainly do the work so bad students can go to AI and turn out some type of term paper, et cetera. But tech companies are so good at creating technical problems and then selling you the solution for that technical problem.

So, like, plagiarism detection software has been around for a long, long time. Right? And so back in the day, it would simply search for pre-existing content that was out there and look to see, you know, does your paper have a bunch of these things in there, either ideas or flat-out quotations? Well, AI actually will help plagiarism software get better and be able to detect whether this term paper you just turned in was overly reliant on [00:07:00] content from one of the LLMs. So, yeah, you could do it, but it's gonna be pretty easy to detect. So, I will humbly contend, this puts me as an outlier, and I'll just own that AI, as you've heard it, is not nearly as powerfully transformational as these things. 

Kevin Weitzel: And in full transparency, I do agree with what you're saying. It was more of a question of just break into Mike's brain, Dr. Mike's brain. I'm sorry. I'm going to say Dr. Mike the rest of the time. 

Greg Bray: Mike, before we go any further, let's make sure people know just what AtlasRTX is, what you guys offer, who you're serving, so they have that context for our conversation.

Mike Bills: Certainly. So, AtlasRTX, our platform can serve any industry. So, it's designed to be again for horizontal, but home building is where we work. So, about 85 percent of our revenue comes from home building, about 12 percent is from higher education, and then the rest is just sort of experiments that we're doing. So, home building is what we know. And it's not because we set out [00:08:00] to build a home building tech company. From the very beginning, Atlas has had a very deep theoretical foundation on which it has all been built. So, I dare say, that we introduced AI into home building.

But we didn't do it because AI is cool, so let's be a hammer and all the world's problems are nails. We solve problems that home builders have, which the big one is it's the dearest purchase most people make. It's fiercely competitive. If you don't do things almost immediately, you're going to lose to your competition. Human beings are great at a lot of things, but they are not great at being immediately responsive, being available 24 hours a day, speaking a hundred languages and always giving the right answer when it understands the question and that's the hard part.

So, what we do is we engage your prospects. We engage them on your website and we can do so immediately with an incredibly sophisticated experience, and then we can follow them after they leave your website with really smart conversational AI in [00:09:00] SMS texting. And so what we're trying to do is help you beat your competition and speed up your sales cycle. And we're really good at that. 
We've been doing it now since 2016, and so I dare say that nobody understands home building like we do, and certainly, nobody has the type of data that we have. So, we have a couple million conversations that are taking place on our platform about home building every month. Seriously, we have such interesting and useful data about budgets and what is motivating people right now, what they're not happy about. And so, if you're really curious about what actual home builders are asking about, you should come talk to us. 

Greg Bray: So, Mike, we just got to make sure everybody's clear that we're talking about before the world knew what ChatGPT was that you guys have been doing this for years before that was a household name.

Mike Bills: That's right. Thank you very much for pointing that out, Greg. So, it has been interesting, I will usually have a bit of a smirk on my face as I sit on a panel [00:10:00] with people about AI, and it's like wait a minute. I knew your business three years ago I had nothing to do with AI but now you guys are AI all the time. Really we have been AI from the very beginning of Atlas going back to 2016 when we started out. 

Greg Bray: For someone who may not be quite as familiar with what AI means how would you define that for the layperson? Because there are a lot of companies that claim to be AI and it's like, well, just because you put it in the company name or the product name doesn't necessarily mean that it's really anything quote-unquote special. So, what does AI mean to you when you use that term? 

Mike Bills: Yeah. So to me, I take it down to like, it's a really reductive and simple definition. Artificial intelligence is automating things that humans don't want to do or they're not good at. It's that simple. So, there's been AI in people's lives for a long time. Those of you who use Google Maps or Waze, it kind of knows where you're going, right? [00:11:00] It knows the places you've been. That's AI. Spellcheck and Grammarly, stuff like that. That's AI. You've had AI as a part of your life, for a while. 

This generative piece that came in, and it was a step change in the type of AI that's out there. And so, that was a new type of AI that was out there. It's in the bag of tools that is, AI. So, AI has been around for a quite a long time. I've lectured on this many times. But you can go back to like the 1940s, this is just the latest, greatest. And it's a tool that's useful for certain things. It's not useful for everything. 

Greg Bray: Let's tie it back into home building and the kinds of things that you were talking about from the conversations you guys get to see. Because as I understand it, when you talk about conversations, you're talking about your tools engaging with perspective buyers via homebuilder websites, things like that. As you guys look at some of those conversations and the patterns, what have you seen any type of trends or evolution over the last few years? [00:12:00] Is it the same kind of conversations from 3 or 4 years ago? Are the conversations different now than they used to be? What kinds of insights come from that data? 

Mike Bills: Great question. I don't think the answer that I'm about to give you is going to break any ground. It's kind of like a lot of academic research is just a laborious way of describing the things that were common sense anyway. So, that's a little bit what I'm going to give you, but at least it's supported by data. So, if we go back say three years ago, the conversations had a lot to do with availability. What's available that I can go right now? So, the speed to move, the readiness to buy, that was at top of mind that people were asking our chatbots about.

It's really different now. Things are all about affordability. You've seen more interest in affordable type homes, townhomes, etc, that kind of thing. So, there has been a huge change over the last couple of years. But again, I'm not blowing anybody's mind with that. So, all the stuff that you're experiencing [00:13:00] anecdotally, yeah, I have the data to tell you that yeah, that's exactly right, that's a broad trend. 

Greg Bray: It is always interesting when people do a research study and you get the answers like, well, duh, what did you expect? But without the data, it was just really an educated guess without the backup. So, the backup is good to have with that. What about ,Mike, as you go with builders who don't have tools like yours, and then they implement something like that, what type of impact does the technology have in the builder's ability to better serve their buyer? Is it something that they see a huge change, an incremental change? What type of impact have you seen?

Mike Bills: There's a spectrum of outcomes there. So, if you're a well-run organization that doesn't have technology and you implement technology, you're likely to have really, really strong results. If you're a poorly run organization and you implement technology, you're likely to have lackluster results. So, we can't fix what you guys do wrong. 

[00:14:00] Working your leads, which is a problem. At least if you're talking to the CEO of a home builder, everybody's frustrated with their salespeople. In fact, that's how we got into home building in the first place. You know, we had tried a bunch of different industries, but when we spoke with Joel Shine, CEO of Woodside Homes at the time, he said, I spend a fortune driving people to our model homes and my salespeople don't follow up with them. If you could automate that some way and move the conversion needle just like one percentage point, that would drop 50 million at the bottom line. Its impact would be so huge. 

Atlas, one of our mantras is humans and AI are better together. So, we're here to help your team, but if your team isn't going to lean in and help itself with the technology, you're not going to have the results that you want. People want to buy from people that they like, people that understand them, so our job with AI is to get people nurtured and get your people in contact with those that are ready to buy. But if you're not a well-run organization and your [00:15:00] salespeople aren't going to jump up, you're going to have lackluster results. So, we have a spectrum of outcomes among our home builder clients. The ones that have the best results are also the ones that are the best run. 

Greg Bray: So, basically automating a bad process just makes things go bad faster. 

Mike Bills: Yeah, that's a good point. Yep. 

Kevin Weitzel: Throwing good money at bad. 

Mike Bills: Yeah.

Greg Bray: One of the things that we hear a lot about, Mike, in kind of the follow up world around leads is the consumer expectation of quick response. You know, some people say, Oh, you've got 24 hours. Oh, you've got five minutes. Oh, you've got two seconds to get back to somebody or they're moving on. What do you guys kind of preach in that area of what consumers really expect from a response time, and how does technology kind of help people achieve some of those goals? 

Mike Bills: When that question comes up, I typically respond with a question, and that question is, what are your favorite consumer experiences? They'll talk about the car they bought in [00:16:00] Carvana or the Tesla that they've bought or Amazon or Netflix or some of these things. Every single one of those is on demand right now. I don't need to wait for your office hours. I don't need to wait for you to reach out to me. I'm empowered to do things myself and do it right now. Those are the kind of consumer experiences that are consistently rated the best kind.

This idea that we want white glove service, right? The three of us, being superannuated as we are, we know what that means. But the younger people here, they're going to be like, what the hell is that guy talking about, white glove service? But that being guided by somebody there to help you out all the time, that used to be what the best types of service are. That is not the way it is now. We want stealth service empowerment, and we want to be able to do things immediately. Buying a home, I would contend, is no different. Yet I run into opposition to that all the time where I hear back from home builder people, well, yeah, [00:17:00] everything else that we buy we want like that, but homes are special. They're different, so we want to do it like we did in 1988. I don't think that that's the way most consumers expect to be.

So, I mean, obviously COVID was this amazing disruption that pulled innovation forward, like 10 years. Home builders, when they had no other choice, like, okay, we'll put some automation out there. And boy, the data is really, really powerful to show the differences between like conversion rates of having an automated chatbot on your website versus a live chat widget on your website. It's like seven to 10 times more leads that you'll collect with automation. And while that may be a little counterintuitive, who cares? The data speaks for itself. 

Kevin Weitzel: People do like widgets and they do like the efficiencies. But I think that there is one outlier that kind of negates the thought process there. And we're talking 1%, you know, those one-percenters, those elites. I'm talking to the people that are in the stratosphere with the [00:18:00] economy. I think that they still like that white glove treatment and they prefer that. And they are looking for the person that comes to their office to show them all the suits that are available this year, which isn't reality for 99.9% of the population. 

So, I think you're right that there are a few exceptions like that extreme high-end custom home builder . They might find a client that prefers to be walked through the entire process and be coddled. You know, oh Mike, that is a fantastic decision you made with your countertops. It's like it's countertop. So, yeah, I agree with you that it comes down to your efficiencies, what you put in place, how fast can I get the information, how accurate is the information, and how fast can I move through the entire process.

Mike Bills: Yeah, and Kevin, that's a great point. So, having just come from IBS, at our booth, we would have a few, probably a half dozen home builders that are a lot like what you just described that are doing multimillion dollar homes that are doing a dozen of those a year. That's a great business, by the way, great business. When they talk to us, [00:19:00] it's just real quick for us to say, we are not a fit for you. You don't need automation and you shouldn't use it. You're good to just handle that. So, we are not a hammer and all the world's problems are nails No, we are fit for those where there's some element of scale and that staffing up with human beings is either impractical or will deliver a suboptimal, customer experience. 

Kevin Weitzel: The way you buy a BMW is different than the way you'd buy a Rolls Royce, is what you're saying.

Mike Bills: Exactly. Yeah. 

Greg Bray: But I would also push back just a little, Kevin. While that person who does want that guided white glove service, they don't want to wait three weeks for their appointment, they don't want to say, Oh, I want you to bring all this or show me around. And by the way, it's going to take me three days to answer your email. I don't think the patient's level of response time is different, even if we do want the guided path through. I mean, we're a very impatient society. We want our [00:20:00] answers and we want them now. 

Kevin Weitzel: But the people in that elite class don't even want to wait in a line for an appointment. They just expect to be immediately taken care of. 

Greg Bray: Yeah, for sure. So, Mike, where is the line then between the automation and the person? You talked about working together. We're not trying to replace the sales team. We might be trying to change their focus a little bit with something like this. Where do you guys kind of put that line of automation and technology and then real people? 

Mike Bills: Great question. I'm so glad you asked. I tend to think of our digital assistants, if you will, as just members of your workforce. And just like with an all human workforce team, we divide the labor, right? We don't have anybody who is doing our accounting and are selling and, you know, working the warehouse, et cetera. We have a division of labor and so we put people that specialize in an area and they do that job and then they work as a team and collaborate with the other members of their team.

So, sales coordinates with finance. You know, in home building, you've got to be [00:21:00] coordinated with your land team and the building. So, we just do that. We're used to it. And these digital workers, they're just a member of the team. And they happen to specialize in these tasks of being always available and they're really good at asking questions that humans don't necessarily want to and they'll ask everybody the questions. So, they're really good at nurturing the lead, but then once they've done that and identified that I've got somebody that's qualified, they're done. Then it's time to bring them in your salesperson. 

So, let the AI do its job of engaging somebody at two o'clock in the morning and figuring out if they're qualified or not, and chasing them down if they're not being responsive. Because that's one thing our human salespeople do not want to do. AI is great at doing that. But then it's done, and now it's time to bring in the human. Because what humans are really really good at, they're good at reading the room, seeing your body language, and empathizing, and most importantly humans are really good at persuading. AI is so far away from being good at [00:22:00] that, So, that's where we need to bring in the humans because they're so much better at that.
 
Greg Bray: So, Mike, you talked about some of the pushback with builders about the process and things there. Do you have one message to those who are pushing back? Is there some big flaw in their argument? Here's your chance to pop the bubble? What would you say?

Mike Bills: Everybody that comes to your website is going to five other builders' websites. Everybody that goes to your model home, they leave your model home and they go to another builder's model home. They're spending the weekend doing that. So, if you're not connecting with them immediately your competitors are. And I hate to use scare tactics, et cetera, but that's just a good one to get people's attention. Like, Oh, wait a minute. I don't operate in a vacuum where everybody's doing this like we used to 10 years ago. No, so many builders are tech-forward.

Another question to also ask is, what's the age demographic of your home buyers. That's an interesting one too, because obviously when people start to think, Oh, I've got a lot of [00:23:00] millennial type buyers. So, yeah, they're going to be open to technology. Well, they're not the only ones. You're 55 plus are too. Because when you think about how do you communicate with your mother or grandparents, your kids? You text them. That's what you do. Unpacking through a series of questions starts to help people figure out for themselves that oh, you're right. We should probably modernize and start to adopt some of this technology. 

And then the other point that I bring up is most people have played with ChatGPT. Everybody's heard about the hallucinations, which is the euphemism for just giving the wrong freaking answer to an important question. Those fears are there. I bring up that idea that we are not a hammer with all the world's problems being nails. We use the right tool, including the right AI tool, for what your customer is expressing their intent is. 

Greg Bray: Do you recommend hiding the fact that it's AI, trying to pretend it's a person, or do you recommend being very open and saying right now [00:24:00] you're talking to the computer and when the time comes I will switch you to talking to the person?

Mike Bills: So, I am emphatically the latter, that we are overt that we are AI for a couple of reasons, and they're very important reasons. The first of which is an ethical reason. I don't want to be in the business of fooling people. That just seems wrong. The second reason is that people will tell things to AI that they won't tell to a human. When somebody leaves a model home to just get away from the salesperson, they'll tell them whatever the hell they think they need to tell them to just get them to leave them alone. 

Our salespeople all think that they're brilliant psychologists that are able to tell if this person is a real buyer or they're just a tire kicker or whatever, and the reality is we're all terrible at that. AI is so much better and people are honest and candid with AI. They will tell AI that they didn't like that salesperson. They'll tell AI that they didn't like that house, but they'll also tell the AI [00:25:00] about things that they do like, and that's really useful information. But again, they likely wouldn't tell your salesperson, for a variety of reasons. So, it's useful to let people know that it is AI for the reasons of candor. 

And then it's also useful when you say, let me bring in a member of my team because that also implicitly communicates we're at a new stage of this buying journey, so now it's off to the person. So I think that there are ethical and practical reasons why it's important. There are also legal reasons. You know, the state of California has mandate, it's hard to tell exactly how they'll enforce that because as far as I know, there's not any case law. But they have expressly said that you need to identify to a consumer on a website when it's AI. So, there's a bunch of reasons why you should. I think they're all good. 

Kevin Weitzel: Let me ask you this though. You don't just work in the homebuilding industry. You work in higher education and other industries as well. Obviously, you're adjacent to many other platforms and many [00:26:00] other non home building specific AI uses. What trends are you seeing, you know, amongst your nerdy brethren of what's coming up in the world that people need to pay attention to? 

Mike Bills: First I'll start out with a warning. That warning would be don't believe anybody's claims about AI who has a vested financial interest in AI being a big deal, including me. So, take it with a grain of salt. But most importantly, when Sam Altman starts talking about where we're headed with AI, pay attention to what he's saying because he's talking about things that they are going to do. He's not talking at all about things that they do. 
Most of the talk about AI seems lik
e it's designed to pump up valuations, but they're not talking about current things that they're capable of doing. It's all, Hey, don't pay attention to what we have. Pay attention to what I say that we're going to have. So, I think that's the very, very important disclaimer [00:27:00] that comes with any question about what are the trends about AI. 

The agentics that the digital agents that are specialized in doing tasks to be helpful to people, I think that's a cool and useful trend. Kevin, you're going to find that I typically tend to go to what's useful as opposed to like what funky cool tech stuff is happening. Because technology is only useful to solve business problems, at least in the business world, if it's not solving a problem, who really cares about it. So, I tend to really focus on what business problems are we trying to solve and what's the useful tool for that.

And right now, AI's usefulness, like its proper usefulness, especially relative to the hype of it, the gap between that is so vast, like it's a Grand Canyon. Because the real useful stuff that we're getting right now is, you know, Greg, you're a marketer. I'm sure you use it all the time to help you with like blog content because it doesn't need to be 100 percent accurate. It has to have the right style. [00:28:00] These are the kinds of things you can prompt AI to, and it'll do a nice job. 

Another place where it's had a benefit is improving the productivity of software engineers. But we're sure as hell not going to just have AI write all of our software for us. Boy, that's a scary proposition. So, what we see is it has a multiplying effect on productivity, particular of the very, very best software engineers. Where they used to be able to do 10x of what an average or replacement software engineer could do, if they really understand how to utilize AI, they can be a 50x or a 100x person. So, those are the type of practical benefits that we're getting. 

The idea of AGI, artificial general intelligence, coming and like replacing humans, etc. I don't worry about that. Maybe I should, but to me, that seems mostly hype. And again, I'm kind of a dark pragmatist, so I'm definitely like the least sexy person to ask stuff about AI because I keep going to what is it useful for. 

By the way, [00:29:00] AI also has another interesting challenge. It is a very expensive solution to right now to not very expensive problems. Making computer programmers more productive, it's great, but that's a hell of an expensive solution when you really look at like the total cost of it. OpenAI, their revenue in 2024 was like four billion and they burned nine billion bucks. That's not a model that's sustainable, right? And they've got constraints on power, and we've got environmental issues that are with it. 

Because most of us aren't paying attention, well, what's going on in the back end with all this stuff? There's a lot of challenges and they don't necessarily get solved with scale. The social media networks are great ones. So, you've got hundreds of millions of users on Facebook, Instagram, TikTok, et cetera, and the scale works out really, really well for them because each incremental user, it doesn't increase their incremental costs in any type of way that's linear.

It's pretty linear when you add more users to OpenAI because the compute is [00:30:00] so expensive. So, there's a lot of stuff on the infrastructure backend that's got to be solved before we're going to have these big, massive transformations of society. So, I still think that the changes that we'll see with AI are going to be more incremental and they're going to be adopted because they truly provide utility to us and not just novelty.

Greg Bray: Well, Mike, we really appreciate you spending so much time with us today and sharing so much. Obviously, you're a little deeper in the weeds on some of this than most of us. 

Mike Bills: Sorry, I can't help myself, but go deep in the weeds, Greg. 

Greg Bray: It's good insight. Good reminders to for those of us who just kind of read headlines and don't pay attention to all the rest of it. Do you have just a last quick piece of advice specific to builders and what they should be looking at today and considering? 

Mike Bills: Yeah. So, my parting shot, and it's not going to have much to do with AI at all, is really understand where your consumers are and do your best to break out of whatever paradigm you're in about how home building ought to be. I would [00:31:00] contend that home building ought to be done in a way that it makes consumers really happy. And so, if you match that up, you're going to be really successful. 

Greg Bray: Well, Mike, if somebody wants to connect with you and get in touch, what's the best way for them to reach out? 

Mike Bills: Easiest way is you can email me at mike@atlasrtx.com. So, that should be pretty easy to remember. You can text and call me at 801 209 0266 and I'll gladly speak with you. 

Kevin Weitzel: But let me ask you one parting question. I challenged Bassam with this back in 2016, 2017, somewhere around that period. And I said, Hey, I understand your platform can speak, I don't know, 170 languages, some crazy amount of languages, but have you in your position in the company finally implemented circa seventies jive into that repertoire of languages. If a 70-something pimp, a former pimp, I should say, is looking at acquiring and purchasing a home, can he get on and speak airplane-era, pimp talk, jive. 

Mike Bills: Oh, [00:32:00] airplane-era jive. I haven't thought about that in so long. Oh, that's good.   

Kevin Weitzel: Would we still need a Barbara Billingsley character to translate? Or could we just use Atlas for that? 

Mike Bills: So, Kevin, the challenge that we have is we just lack the training data of enough jive. So, if we can get our hands on a trove of training data on jive, oh yeah, we can do it. 

Kevin Weitzel: It is truly relegated to being a dead language, is really what you're saying.

Mike Bills: Unless you act now, Kevin, maybe you can say anything.
 
Greg Bray: Thank you, Mike, for being with us today. We appreciate your time. Thank you, everybody, for listening to tThe Home Builder Digital Marketing Podcast. I'm Greg Bray with Blue Tangerine. 

Kevin Weitzel: And I'm Kevin Weitzel with OutHouse. Thank you.   [00:33:00]