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25 Avoid Costly Hiring Mistakes in Real Estate - JoAnne Williams

Avoid Costly Hiring Mistakes in Real Estate - JoAnne Williams

Show Notes

JoAnne Williams Linkedin

JWilliams Staffing Linkedin



(949) 250-1923

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Production by:  KT Maschler and Josh Williamson

Editing by: KT Maschler 

This week on the HBDM Podcast we welcomed JoAnne Williams, Founder, President, and CEO of JWilliams Staffing to discuss how to avoid costly hiring mistakes in the real estate world. JoAnne also takes a deep dive into her vast experience, sharing tips on recruiting as well as her expertise in building elite teams. During this episode, you'll learn several tips like what to look for in potential employees as well as how you can stand out as a candidate.

As a Home Building veteran, Williams has been involved in several areas of the home industry. Such as a VP for a publicly-traded home builder, as well as her numerous contributions such as Past President and member of the Sales & Marketing Councils, and instructor for segments of the National Association of Home Builders. Not to mention being named 2004 recipient of the Southern California BJ Stewart Women’s Achievement Award.

JWilliams Staffing is a multi-award-winning full-service staffing and placement firm servicing the home industry in 15 regions across California, Arizona, Nevada, and Texas with offices opening soon in Colorado. Their unique understanding of each and every one of their candidate's strengths and weaknesses gives JWillams Staffing the reputation of being the best recruiters in the industry. 


 [00:00:00]Greg Bray: Hello everybody. And welcome back to another exciting episode of the Home Builder Digital Marketing Podcast. I'm Greg Bray with Blue Tangerine 

Kevin Weitzel : and I'm Kevin Weitzel with Outhouse, 

Greg Bray: we are excited today to be joined by JoAnne Williams. JoAnne is the founder and CEO of J Williams staffing. Welcome, JoAnne. 

JoAnne  Williams: Thank you. My pleasure to be here. 

Greg Bray: Well, we really appreciate you, uh, sharing your time with us and hope to pick your brain a little bit and learn some of the things that, that you've learned over the years and, and tap in, and especially to some of that, [00:01:00] uh, you know, team building and recruiting knowledge that you've got there.

So looking forward to it, but, uh, you know, for those who haven't met you yet, JoAnne, why don't you give them a quick introduction about who you are? 

JoAnne  Williams: Alrighty. Well, I've been in home building since I was in my twenties. It's something that I think just gets in your blood and in once you've had a good experience, it's just, you know, comfortable there.

Um, I started my business in 2003. And we started out by life offering just licensed temporary salespeople for builders and their sales centers. And that was my ultimate goal never realizing that we would grow and proliferate the way we did, but now we're in five States and doing quite well, um, Our company, uh, provides for those, for those who don't know who we are, uh, J Williams Staffing provides temporary staffing temp to hire and direct placement.

Uh, and we specialize in new home sales and now property management and all associated real estate support services. 

Greg Bray: Okay. No, that's that's terrific. [00:02:00] Well, tell us something before we get too far into the conversation.

Just something that people don't know about you, something, uh, kind of one of those secrets that isn't so dark that you can't share it in public, but you know, 

JoAnne  Williams: Oh gosh. Well, the people who do know me well know that I'm a, um, I'm a transplanted farm girl from Eastern South Dakota. Now not everybody knows this, but when you come from that part of the country, a lot of us music lessons, and, um, I am one of those that spent six years.

In taking accordion lessons because it lasts what you do in the upper Midwest. When you're a little kid here, want to go music lessons, not everybody knows that about me, but, um, I actually came out to California when I was 24 and having come from such a rural environment, uh, everything about it fascinated me, just the smell of the ocean and, you know, especially the density of housing and just.

Uh, the [00:03:00] architecture, the plan neighborhoods, all of that was something that I was just a little more than curious about. So it sort of pulled me in the direction when I had some opportunities to look into real estate. Now 

Kevin Weitzel: you got me, you got me perplexed here on this whole Squeezebox, uh, uh, information that just came to light.

Are we more of like a polka background or accompaniment background?

JoAnne  Williams: Polka. 

Kevin Weitzel: WHAT!

JoAnne  Williams: Yeah, no, by the time I was probably like five years ago when I actually, you know, still played a little, played around a little bit with it. I was kind of down to two songs, the be happy waltz and the barnyard polka. And that was the extent of my confidence on it anymore.

Kevin Weitzel: Nice. Nice. 

Greg Bray: I'm just, I'm just wondering how difficult it is to find an accordion instructor. If I want my kids to start, you know, getting into that, 

JoAnne  Williams: it's hard to find an accordion. [00:04:00] Yeah. Yeah. Cause my mind needs repairing. It's not easy right now. You can't find it, but yeah. That's a whole different thing anyway, but that's, that's a little something, not everybody knows about me.

Greg Bray: Yeah. No, that's, that's terrific. Thanks for sharing. That's definitely, uh, definitely kind of different. So we'll have to, we'll have to get you on some time where you've got your recording with you. 

JoAnne  Williams: Yeah not a chance.

Greg Bray: Well, JoAnne, I know I, you know, with, with your staffing company, um, You know, one of the things that I understand that you do is you're basically helping people build their teams and find the right people, you know? So I've heard it myself. I've, I've felt it sometimes, you know, um, that it's, it's always hard to find good people.

Right. Have you ever kind of had that, that thought of like, why can't I do it? Just find good people easier? What makes that so hard? What is it that, uh, why do we, why do we feel that way? 

JoAnne  Williams: Well, I mean, the truth of it is good. People are hard to find. And, um, there's just that combination of the [00:05:00] soft skills that you look for in their personality traits and their values, and then mixed with what their heart experience has been and how that, how their past experience applies to what they have.

So putting all that together and, and creating a checklist of criteria that you're looking for is really an important step. And I think some people, um, Don't do that well. And so they, you know, they find, they find like, they feel like they're looking for a needle in a haystack, so I get it. Yeah. But it is true.

It is a really great employees and it's not so much that good people are hard to find. Good matches are more difficult to find because not everybody understands what it takes to make a good match when you're, you know unless you're a recruiter. 

Greg Bray: And how did you go from, from starting and, you know, the home building industry, and then move into kind of HR and recruiting and staffing.

How did that kind of evolve for you? 

JoAnne  Williams: Oh, well, interesting. Uh, as a sales manager for costing homes [00:06:00] for them for 10 years and a VP of sales and marketing, you are hiring a lot of salespeople and, you know, sometimes you pick someone who's a great choice and sometimes you don't and you always hopefully learn from all of those, mistakes, but, you know, hiring mistakes are incredibly, expensive when you think about the overall picture of it, so, you know, you hopefully learn really fast. And in that process, when, when that particular company. Closed. It was during the downturn in, um, I think it was 97, exactly. When they closed. Uh, I went into staffing and I sort of was sorry. And I helped by somebody who had a temporary services agency and was familiar with me because I was a client.

And I utilize their services kind of creatively by creating efficiencies in the way I would use their temporary services in combination with what I had on my staff. So, um, with that, she thought I might be a good fit, which I was. And I worked for that staffing [00:07:00] company for a couple of years. And then like anybody who has a better idea, I started my own company because I wanted to do it my way.

So I started how I moved into it, but I'm very, self-taught when it comes to, HR because HR is super dynamic, constantly changing. You have to be reading. I read every single day of articles and updates on what's happening in the HR world. And especially now in this situation, we're in with COVID-19, there's so many other overlaying pieces.

Kevin Weitzel: Now I'm curious if you find what I found, do all salespeople come in as self-proclaimed rockstars that they're going to adjust, exceed all expectations, or do you find a normal mix of, of realistic, uh, applicants? 

JoAnne  Williams: I think we have a normal mix across all, you know, Gosh, gender ethnic skillset level.

Uh, we have a pretty good mix because we recruit so many, I mean, we [00:08:00] hire 1500 to 2000 people a year, so that's a lot of imagining that we have to go through 100 or 200 resumes to hire 10. So imagine the sorting process that that takes. So yeah, we get every, we get all kinds. 

Greg Bray: I was just kind of thinking one of the challenges that I've always felt in hiring salespeople is if they're good salespeople, they're selling you something, right.

There's someone they're selling themselves. So that's always going to be this extra little, um, you know, challenge with that particular job, uh, and position compared to maybe some other types of hires.

Greg Bray:     So let's just take a moment and talk about the upcoming 2020 home builder digital marketing summit virtual series. It's going to be starting on October 29th. 

Kevin Weitzel: And if you don't want to be a knuckle dragon mouth breather like myself, then you better register now. 

Greg Bray: That's right. I think [00:09:00] it doesn't matter if you're an experienced chief marketing officer, or if you're brand new to the home building industry, we are giving you a chance to take your marketing and sales to the next level, by learning from the top home building digital marketing experts. 

Kevin Weitzel: You're going to be able to do more and sell more homes by learning from the industry's best. And when we say the industry's best, we mean it. We're talking Jimmy Diffee, Angela McKay, Bassam Salem, Spencer Powell, Dana Kovach, Chris Hartley,  Eric Martinez, Stuart Platt,  Greg Bray, a builder panel. And of course myself, Kevin Weitzel. 

Greg Bray: It's truly a star-studded lineup, Kevin.

And for that, tell him how much it's going to cost. 

Kevin Weitzel: $15,000. Now we're just kidding. It's only actually going to be nothing it's free. So get your whole team together buildermarketingsummit.com. It's all virtual. So you can learn from your home, your office, or your home office. 

Greg Bray: We know you're busy. So we're trying to accommodate your schedule.

The home builder digital marketing summit virtual series will be two hours once a week on Thursdays for 40. 

Kevin Weitzel: It definitely [00:10:00] won't wreck your schedule, but you'll still learn a ton of tricks that you can put into practice right away. 

Greg Bray: So go to buildermarketingsummit.com today and register and

remember it's free and now let's get back to the podcast.

 Greg Bray: So, um, JoAnne, what are, what are some of those common mistakes you've seen people make as they're going about their recruiting process and that kinda get in the way of helping them find that right fit you were talking about  

JoAnne  Williams: I think one thing that people don't do is they underestimate how complicated the process could be for them by rushing it. So they don't, they, they just don't do enough due diligence. sometimes they look for somebody to connect with that's just like them because they think, Oh, they'll fit in with me or they'll be able to manage them better or they'll be part of a team. Cause they're just like everybody else on the team forgetting that they come as their own person and they have their own personality, skillset and things that might not be exactly what the first impression is. And then, [00:11:00] um, also some, some employers are so interested in selling the position or the company, you know, like, Oh my gosh, you know, we're such a great company to work for.

JoAnne  Williams: You're just going to love it here and all that. That's, they're talking more than they're listening. So they're selling the position in their company and they, they're not really listening to what the candidate is saying about what they're actually going to bring to the table. And so they, they consider it a match before they have enough information.

They just don't get enough information basically. 

 Greg Bray: I can, I can see that where you go. Wow. They, they did a great job of listening to me, tell my story. They must be a great person. So, um, let's hire them. Yeah, I'm sure that's, you know, cause especially owners, right. We love to talk about our company. So will talk about it a long times 

JoAnne  Williams: it happens.

Greg Bray: So, so then as we try to overcome some of that, you know, You talked about not rushing the process and not, um, you know, talking too much  I mean, what, what does that process look like in general? What kind of a process you guys use [00:12:00] and, you know, is that just one meeting? I'm sure it's more than one meeting, but you know, just tell us a little bit more about that, how that works.

JoAnne  Williams: I think every company is a little bit different and every job that they're recruiting for is maybe just a little bit different, but there are three or four steps that I find are the best for any company to consider. Number one, to have a prescreening phone call with an applicant, because a lot of people and not just nowadays, but they'll just blanket the market with their resume, hoping that, you know, they'll just kind of throw it against the wall and see what sticks and see if you know what kind of interests they can generate in their resume.

So sometimes you'll call them and they'll say, what was the position I applied for again? Yeah. I mean, seriously, I'm not joking. And so you'll tell them and they'll go, Oh, so then you have to do a little explaining about what it is and you know, this, this happens not just when you're in mass recruiting, like what are you are, but a lot of companies, because they just have had this come up.

So what we like to do is have that prescreening call, talk to them a little bit about their interests once [00:13:00] we've. Ascertained that they understand what the job is, you know, what their interest level is, how their skill sets might fit with that particular job. And then we'll usually do something that I think tests their listening skills.

We say, have you been to our website? And if they haven't recommend that they visit it, um, you say, you tell them, I'm going to send you with this email. That's on your resume here. Uh, uh, a, a job description for the job, the exact job that we're talking about, not the one that was advertised, which is maybe kind of a scaled-down version, but a more comprehensive job description.

And then third, why don't you think about it? Gave it a little more thought and then, uh, email me and let me know what your interest level is. So now you've got, if they're interested, you have their attention and you will see what they come back with in their followup email, that would be step one that prescreening call.

 Step two if they send back an email and the email they send back will tell you a [00:14:00] lot about who they are, how they communicate, just all kinds of information about how well they listened. Um, and then from there, if you can set up a face to face meeting and, um, that could be with the recruiter who did the prescreening call or a pre-screen can be done by one person and then their recruiter sets up the first face to face meeting.

It just depends on how your company is structured. But I would say if you do a face to face meeting without a prescreening phone call, you're wasting a lot of time. And this person has come into the office already once and you may want them to come in two more times and that's a lot, it's a lot to ask any candidate.

Kevin Weitzel: So besides not having to be reminded what job they're actually even applying for, what are some competent mistakes that you see with applicants? Uh, you know, maybe some, some roadblocks that they're actually creating for themselves. 

JoAnne  Williams: Um, two major ones. One is, uh, I call it just TMI. they're providing too much information and in that [00:15:00] information, there are things that, you know, really are telling, um, they go into long stories that are, you know, overdramatized or they'll bad mouth, their prior employer, another thing that comes up is that their resume contains inaccuracies. That in conversation you're sort of, they sort of are drawn out so that there are, or there are gaps in the resume and, you know, they don't have an I mean, if somebody says, look, I, I stayed on for two years because my husband was finishing his, you know, studying for the bar and I kept the kid, whatever.

I mean, at least there's something, I just have a three-year gap in the resume and they don't have, they don't even have a comeback for it. That's pretty tough or another big one is, um, they're, they're too much use of slang or profanity, even if they're joking. And I know that sounds like, you know, how would anybody be that silly, but it happens and it's just.

Or they have some really sad, you know, story that they [00:16:00] roll out, you know, why they've become unemployed or why you should hire them. I mean, it's just, all, this is all under the TMI. 

Kevin Weitzel: You basically want it to be drama free when they start bringing the drama and they're creating their own. Cause I don't want to deal with that when I hire them.


JoAnne  Williams: Exactly. Exactly. 

Greg Bray: I know. I know for me, JoAnne, just the hiring that I've done. I also find that that when they, um, all their reasons to kind of that question, why, why do you want this job? What job are you looking for? Type of a question. And they, they get into things that are all about well i need more money, or I need, you know, more, whatever, you know, this is why I want this job, right.

As opposed to how they're going to benefit me or what they want to learn, or, you know, be being the company they're going to work for, you know, what are you going to bring to the table? I think that's a mistake I've seen too. 

JoAnne  Williams: I will add that. I've heard from, um, friends, and people in the industry and stuff.

When we, when we, that subject comes to recruiting and interviewing, they'll say things [00:17:00] like, well, you know, it just seems like the younger generation or the millennials quote-unquote, have this, entitlement attitude or whatever. And I feel completely different about that. Completely. 

Greg Bray: Okay. 

JoAnne  Williams: Now I may get a question from a young person, like, well, where do you see me in two years from now, at this company?

Or what do you think the next step for me at this company is, or what can I expect? And you know, that kind of like really deep in-depth, you know, they really want to know. And a lot of kind of old older school, um, recruiters or actions say recruiters are more used to it, but people within a company who are interviewing a younger person don't like to have those questions because they, they put that under the category of, Oh, they're so entitled. I don't think of it that way. Look at those young people. And I believe that when we were interviewing for jobs and we were that age, we wanted to ask those questions. We didn't ask them because at the time you just didn't ask, you just went in and worked your behind off until, you know, [00:18:00] somebody came and surprised you with the next promotion and you were happy about it, but he didn't dare things like that.

And now when they ask things like that, I actually think it's an opportunity. To talk to them about what your expectations are, you know, what you expect them to do and their performance and how that results in something better within the company. And so I have found that to be, uh, we, we have a pretty good retention level with, with our employees.

So I think a lot of us have just direct conversations about expectations. 

Greg Bray: So JoAnne, you mentioned the face to face interview, which of course face to face means something different now than it used to today's, you know, have you, have you seen a difference in the process as, yeah. And again, not just now, but also when you're hiring for someone who's in a remote area that remote being, you know, not local to where you are because the company's got multiple locations, you know, where you're doing kind of that video conference or that zoom call, you know, version of the [00:19:00] interview. Is that, is that harder? Can you still do everything the same? Is there something we need to do different as an applicant or as an interviewer and that type of a scenario that we wouldn't do face to face?

JoAnne  Williams: Interesting question. And I'm interesting in that I was surprised how much it didn't interfere with the process of face to face interviewing. Um, I think that you know, I just imagined that being face to face in a conference room or where it was hard to replace and it is, however. Um, people do a pretty good job.

If they're serious about the interview there, where they're set up, how they're, how they're dressed for success and you know, just me and they, they show up and they look like they're serious. And, um, I found it, I found it that it works pretty well. Actually. I've just had to hire two new managers, which I, I was, you know, like step three or four in the process.

So, um, by the time they got to me, they had already had a couple of interviews with our, with our troops, but. [00:20:00] Uh, I, I just found it to work fine. I don't know what long term, how we'll do that. I don't know that I prefer it, but I certainly don't think it's gotten much in the way.

Greg Bray: No, that's great. That's great. Thanks for those insights. So tell us a little bit more about, um, you know, you know, we've got these folks that are, that are trying to get the interview, right? The resume's job is to get to the interview. So that's, that's kind of what I've always heard. What are some things that you're looking for as you scan resumes when you talked about going through, you know, hundreds of resumes all at once?

They're not all at once, but, you know, to find a one opportunity, um, what are you looking for? What are some tips there? Are things people do right. And do wrong with their resumes. 

JoAnne  Williams: Some people get too cute. I mean, they just have like really fancy signs or they wear, they don't, they don't have the clear information.

I mean, a recruiter will look at the top of a resume. They want to see the name. They want to see the contact information and then they start scanning are a couple of kinds of resumes. Some of them have some skillsets outlined at the [00:21:00] top, kind of in a couple of little columns, and the other start right in with just sort of the career history.

And I always like to see the most recent backward so that you see what they're doing now if they're currently working if it says, and when it says, you know, uh, nobody number 2018 to present, and then you get in a conversation with them and you find out they have, I haven't been employed for a year, but they haven't bothered to update their resume.

So, what they send you makes them, I hear that they're still employed. That's a little disturbing, so they need to have accurate information on there. And by all means, if there's anything that they're fudging on, just a length of time at an employer or a educational background or anything like that as just a really big No no.

Um, and it's nice if they don't have too cute, you know, not like, you know, my kitty@gmail.com is not the most professional, you know, Uh, email address. If you're looking for a job, I always think it's like first name dot last name is [00:22:00] probably theBest@gmail.com. 

Kevin Weitzel: Unless they're applying for a cat sitting service.


You never know 

JoAnne  Williams: I know, i know

Kevin Weitzel: what job, what job did I applied for? 

JoAnne  Williams: Right?

Greg Bray: Well, JoAnne there's, there's a whole nother market you can go after, you know, 

Kevin Weitzel: exactly

Greg Bray: you'll just have to give Kevin a 10% commission for that. 

Kevin Weitzel: So for a builder, that's looking for your services. Do they just contact you and then, uh, say, Hey, I need four salespeople.

We've got a big sale coming up. Or how does that whole transactional transpire? 

JoAnne  Williams: Usually, yes, that is how it happens.  if they're calling for placement outside of an area where we offer temporary services, they usually find us on the way website and it comes up they'll Google, temporary employment companies will pop up, but a lot of times the builder will call, I'd say, yes, we have a grand opening, or now they're calling it an unveiling. I think right now, during these times, um, then, they need some extra help. And in all that, uh, all but [00:23:00] Texas right now all of our temporary salespeople are licensed required by the state.

So, yeah. And then we get the details about the assignment and then we match up the best candidate. Um, given sort of, you know, maybe they've had somebody out there or they've heard of somebody or they've got some requests for a bilingual or some other qualifications, so we've matched them up and then fill the assignment.

Greg Bray: JoAnne is your, as you're sitting there trying to figure out that match, what, what are things that you talked to the builder about that help you understand what they want and what they need? But so that, you know what, you're trying to match a person too, for that position. 

JoAnne  Williams: Okay, well, obviously, um, we can't discriminate, so there's not a whole lot of questions that we can ask other than the tasks that are going to be required of them.

Um, if it's something that is going to require, let's for instance, say that they need somebody on a, on an iPad to be doing an exit survey. And they're in one of the model homes. Well, then [00:24:00] we would have to have, they would have to have that expertise or have some kind of tech-savvy skill to do that.

And they'd also have to be comfortable on their feet all day. Typically working, you know, greeting people as they walk out the door, if it's somebody who's, um, working alone, then they're obviously going to be more experienced than somebody who might be, be there helping put together price sheets, and brochures.

So it just depends on what the task is that they have creates that. And also we try to keep somebody who's geographically within 20 miles of the assignment. 

Greg Bray: Do you ever get into culture fits with the builder as well, trying to understand, you know, the way they work and how a person may or may not kind of fit into their culture.

JoAnne  Williams: Not so much on the temporary level, definitely on the, on the direct hire level for sure. Okay. Yeah. 

Greg Bray:  I'm kind of looking more from, that's something that we we're, we're hiring at blue Tangerine. We're always kind of looking for that culture fit. How do you define that? How do you figure that [00:25:00] out?

Kevin Weitzel: JoAnne, I think I want to add this because I think I know where Greg is going with this. When I want to specify without being just completely discriminatory that I need to hire some nerds, some high tech dorks. How do I dance around that delicately without discriminating? It's the simpleton knuckle draggers like myself.

JoAnne  Williams: Well, I would categories categorize them as what we call prioritizers and they're more head down, you know, introverts, but we do third party assessments. And we're happy to do that. Whenever a client quest, something that's specific, say, look, we will give you a third-party assessment and it will, it will not, they only show you where they fall on all these levels and there are no wrong answers to these things.

These are not, you know, putting people into, um, discriminatory columns. It's just basically saying these are their tendencies. And so it, it helps let's say, I mean, it helps understand who may not be a fit completely, but [00:26:00] it also helps with your, in the area of where they will be a fit, how to manage that person.

And how they like to be managed. So you know, what they appreciate and how they work. So how they're more productive. So I just find that third-party assessments are great. We use the Berke assessment. There are plenty out there. So I don't know if that answers your question. 

Greg Bray: Well, um, Kevin Kevin's version of my question was not exactly the way I ever would have put it, so yeah, 

Kevin Weitzel: I didn't mean to hijack it,  really did, but I couldn't help myself.

JoAnne  Williams: No, I get it. I think what Greg was asking was more about, like, if you have an I, I like to say like in our company, for instance, if you are not a good fit, you you would know it in a month if we don't catch it, which is rare for, you know, it in a month, because we're such a performance-driven team that everyone works really hard. So if there's a slacker, they would absolutely not survive. 

Kevin Weitzel: Well could it even be [00:27:00] differentiated by my personality types? Like in my case, You know what I'm in the office, but if your culture was the quiet, everybody has their own workstation. We don't disturb each other. I might not be the best fit for that company.

Is that what you're talking about, Greg? 

Greg Bray: Yeah. And how you start to understand that from, you know, because that may be difficult to verbalize, you know, and yet you're trying to interview people and, and make that match and how you kind of dig deep into those types of issues. I just, it just fascinates me so sorry to spend so much time on it

JoAnne  Williams: No, no you know what you are absolutely right. And, um, to your point, when we talk to companies who are trying to hire, you know, direct hire full-time employees, we ask questions like that. So tell me what, what it's like to come into work on a Monday or Tuesday, you know, what's the environment like, are you, you know, is it like, is it loud? Is it, is it, you know, is there a lot of excitement around or, or is it pretty much heads down?

Let's get our stuff done and. You know, everybody sneaks out for lunch and it's quiet all the time. Yeah. [00:28:00] That's a totally different culture and you're right. you have to have the right match in that regard too, or at least understanding it. Knowing what you're getting into. 

Greg Bray: No, absolutely.  you know, we always like to say, you can, we can teach skills, but it's, it's hard to, it's hard to teach culture, you know, it's better if we can start with, with someone who matches a little bit better.

So JoAnne, one of the things that I I've heard when people talk about recruiters and stuff is just this fear that it's expensive to use a recruiter. I can, I can do this myself. I can save that money. You know, what are some of your thoughts on why people ought to consider outsourcing and why it's maybe not, not as expensive as it might look to do that.

JoAnne  Williams: Well, because as I mentioned and hiring, you know, hiring mistakes are enormously costly and they really are. And so if you are looking for an expert to do something and, you know, as a business owner, or even a high-level executive within a company, you are not the best judge. [00:29:00] You're not the most objective person.

To be trying to make that match because as we just discussed, you're not always the one who is, uh, is the best judge of what that whole company culture looks like. 

Kevin Weitzel: And add added to exactly what you said. Cause I, I buy in 100% that it costs you money to hire a mistake, but it also costs you money to hire the whole process.

Are you going to take your rockstar manager and have them worry about sifting through resumes and applications and, just that process when they could be utilized in their role, that is the rockstar role that they are. 

JoAnne  Williams: Right. 

Kevin Weitzel: You know, that there's a cost to that to taking them away from how they're producing for the company. So that's another cost. So yeah, I'm with you. I'm with you, Joanne. A hundred percent. 

JoAnne  Williams: The other thing is I think people underestimate how much it costs to post on a lot of the job boards. I mean, they're really popular job boards, or we have mechanisms to go in behind LinkedIn and contact people that have a little indicator that they might be interested in a job that's not public.

[00:30:00] So when you imagine being able to gather 100 resumes, as opposed to a private company posting for maybe, maybe they're going to spend a thousand or $1,500 on job ads. That sounds cheap compared to what a recruiter might charge them. However, they're only getting a super small sampling. So what happened because it's that busy, busy executive, you talked about, who's now forced to go through the resumes they do have.

Then they pick out the two out of what they have. Not the two out of what they could have, but the two out of what they have, and then they get down to one they've already invested so much time. They're like, well, is this all we have? Well, shoot, I don't know. I guess it's is it bill is essentially a, well, I like Bill's better, but you know, and so they're not really happy.

100% with who the match might be. And I would suggest that it's probably not the best match because there just wasn't enough put into it, whether it's time, money, all of the above. 

[00:31:00] Kevin Weitzel: And do you have any kind of number one guarantees and to any offers like Baker's dozen, your 13th, uh, 13th hire is free or, um, you know, do you have any, any kind of programs like that and not to go into just an advertisement but, but more along the lines of, are there programs that you have.

JoAnne  Williams: Yes. Well, we're one of the recruiting firms. There, there are some, but, but we don't charge a retainer. So we work on contingency. We don't get paid unless we make the match and you're happy. And the candidate accepts and the candidate starts working for you and you like it. And yes, that person is guaranteed.

So, you know, why wouldn't you use a company to help you do something like that in the right way? Do it the right way. Especially if you don't hire many people, but we work with a lot of recruiters that are in house recruiters, people that work for large companies that still need help and they still don't have the time to work through it.

And so they enlist us and they know [00:32:00] that they can still go find somebody on their own. If, if somebody comes to us and says, well, what if we find somebody on our own? Well, then you don't owe us anything, but that's not going to prevent us from going out there and trying to make the match just as though you're never going to find anybody on your own. We're working toward finding that perfect match regardless of what happens. Because a lot of times people will come down to the wire and they'll say, Oh, you know, the president had a referral from so and so, and so that's who we hired. It's like, okay. I mean, it happens, but we're still working hard to find the right match in the meantime.

Does that make sense? And yes, there are like, there are kind of tiered structures when you do a lot of recruiting with us and some companies have where we give them some accommodations 

Greg Bray: No, I want to go back to this idea that you can see on LinkedIn. People that are privately saying that they're open for new opportunities and how I can get you to check my people, to make sure they're not looking for private for other opportunities.

That's a whole another service maybe we need to talk about [00:33:00] putting together here, you know, this who wants to leave lists. Right? 

Kevin Weitzel: So, so basically like geo-fencing your employees. Yeah. I love it. 

JoAnne  Williams:  Right. 

Greg Bray: So JoAnne, we really appreciate your time we want to be mindful of that? So as we kind of wrap things up here, what type of advice would you want to leave with our, with our listeners today? If you could just share one thing with them. 

JoAnne  Williams: Oh, gosh, I think we just talked about it and that is, you know, be, be thoughtful about the process. If you're going to hire a new person, be very thoughtful about the process and the criteria that you're considering and their personality traits.

And remember that a hiring mistakes are costly, so do it right. Do it right with the right people. And if you find the right match, then that's great. 

Greg Bray: Thank you so much, JoAnne.  if somebody wants to learn more or wants to get in touch with you, what's the best way for them, to connect with you?

Um, our website has all of my information on it. JWilliamsstaffing.com. Uh, my email is [00:34:00] joanne@jwilliamsstaffing.com, J O A N N E. And our phone number corporate phone number is (949) 250-1923. And you can reach me that way. 

And that goes for people, looking for jobs and people looking for people. Right? You need them both. 

JoAnne  Williams: We need them both. 

Greg Bray: Terrific. Well, thanks again so much for your time, and thank you everybody for listening today, and we hope you'll join us again. Next time on the Home Builder Digital Marketing Podcast. I'm Greg Bray with Blue Tangerine, 

Kevin Weitzel : Kevin Weitzel with Outhouse.

Thank you.

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